zOwie Omega Discussion Forum

: As to the Omegamania version .... There was a
: blatant fake SM300 (Lot # 128 ) in that
: auction ( authenticated by Omega )...... The
: Bezel on the "Speedmaster Alpha first
: generation" ( lot # 202 ) was from the
: 1987 "Broad Arrow reissue" - lot #
: 20. ( again authenticated by Omega )......
: The dial on the "grail" ( lot #
: 223 ) was the wrong dial. ( again
: authenticated by Omega )...... The dial on
: the "D case" ( lot # 183 ) was the
: wrong dial. ( again authenticated by Omega )
: ...... There are more examples .....

: So , IMHO, the fact that Omega has
: authenticated the watch, doesn't prove that
: it is 100% original.

This subject has come up in various contexts since (and even before) the auction.

It sometimes sounds like I am defending Antiquorum and Omega. I'm not. I am pointing out what is obvious from the auction documents and how some pretty clear language has to be interpreted.

These watches are not artworks that Antiquorum has authenticated and make a representation they are geniune -- or even running. Omegamania is the only auction they don't recommend you immediately have the watch serviced (because Omega already did). They only represent they are not an intentional fake. Artworks don't go to watchmakers for routine maintenance during which parts are replaced. Artworks generally don't get altered by a third party to suit the owner ("can you put the blue SMP bezel on the black SMP?")

The Omega guarantee is very simple.

Define "genuine Omega product". The phrase is subject to interpretation.

Do you expect Omega to have guaranteed that a 125 year old pocket watch is in the same condition as when it left the factory? No? Such a watch has the same guarantee from Omega . . . . .

Do you expect Omega to have records detailing exactly what hands a watch from the 1930s had when it left the factory? No? It has the same guarantee . . . .

But we expect Omega to guarantee that a watch from the 1970s to be in the same condition as when it left the factory, even if the factory may have made the modifications?

Under this standard, the first co-axials which had calibre 2500A movements, which were commonly replaced by calibre 2500B movements when returned to Bienne, wouldn't be "geniune Omega products".

I think we expect more from Antiquorum and Omega than we should. We particularly expect Omega to "take the high road" as the saying goes. They didn't. It is somewhow disappointing, even if it is understandable.

I believe "genuine Omega product" must be interpreted to mean the watch resembles an Omega product sold in the past and is all Omega parts. Nothing more.

Remember also, we are expecting Omega to make reprsentations about watches (in the vast majority of cases) that THEY DON'T OWN or have any history about.

All I can say is "caveat emptor".

One other thought >>>>>>

I have been to viewings of two Antiquorum events, Omegamania and one other. Compare and contrast:

Omegamania: all watches running, with a two year Omega guarantee (except prototypes), all watches in peak restored condition, with the option to have Omega perform additional restorative work if needed or desired, and every lot sold.

Other: 10% of watches not running or an overhaul required, 80% of watches an overhaul recommended, no guarantees, some watches in pitiful condition (it's acrylic guys, 15 minutes with a poshing cloth or toothpaste -- please), no option for any service and 19% of the lots didn't sell.

Omegamania was an exceptional event, viewed in comparison to other auctions.

I wish we didn't have to deal with fakes and puffed up watches. I wiah Omega had taken the high road, and Antiquorum made further efforts to make meaningful comments about the watches that go through their hands.

But we do, they didn't and AQ didn't. Nor is any of this likely to change.

Come here and learn from the experts about what is real and don't believe everything you read, even (especially?) in an AQ catalog.